286 replies to this topic

[JCat04]

We gain some FPS through instancing but it's nowhere near double so not sure where you picked that up John. Then with the new lighting and TE, avatars etc it runs at around the same fps as it did previously just with much higher detail levels.

 

I searched and tried to find the original quote for the frame rates being nearly doubled with SpeedTree GPU instancing, but all I can find is some follow-up discussion about it, wanting to know if SpeedTree instancing was going to make it into Unity 5.4.  Maybe the original thread got deleted, but I do remember being surprised when I originally read it.  I then read that SpeedTree instancing was being pushed out to Unity 5.5.

 

I'll have to reel in my expectations a bit, but at least you do see a performance gain from instancing, enough so that you're seeing the same frame rates as before, with all the new features and graphical enhancements.  I can certainly live with that as I tend to run in the 50 to 55 FPS range currently. 

[Dazmaniac]

Well, if you take an area of rough as small as that of course it can look neat and tidy. I'm talking about the rough in general. Any time I watch golf on TV most of the rough looks exactly that - rough.

OK, let's forget about the 3D grass as its not 'lumpy' enough and just go with what we have now. Uniform flat 2D textures.

Must pay special attention to see how 'lumpy' the rough is at Augusta in a few weeks.

[JCat04]

We gain some FPS through instancing but it's nowhere near double so not sure where you picked that up John. Then with the new lighting and TE, avatars etc it runs at around the same fps as it did previously just with much higher detail levels.

 

Okay, I found the source of that "doubled" frame rate performance... apparently Andrew mentioned during the July 1, 2016 live twitch broadcast that 'something approaching doubling the frame rate had been achieved in testing with a Surface Pro, using Golden Meadows with SpeedTree instancing'.  Here's a link to the thread that picked up on that, among other things:

 

http://www.perfectpa...level/?p=104335

 

The next couple of messages after it are from others who also heard the same thing that Crow heard.  Unfortunately, the archive of that broadcast is no longer available on Twitch.  I wanted to post this to assure you and others I wasn't blowing smoke over it.  I recalled reading it last Summer and was convinced enough by having multiple sources as to its veracity.  It appears now that the test may not have been conducted on equipment that most of us are accustomed to playing the game on, so the results wouldn't necessarily apply to our systems?

[Acrilix]

Ok. Interesting. Is it that the new grass details make the existing avatars really sick out or something?

 

I would imagine its because once the video is compressed the effect will be far less noticeable or impressive in play than on a close-up still screen.

[GoldenBear]

Ok. Interesting. Is it that the new grass details make the existing avatars really sick out or something?

 

I know many do not like Hacker Harry, but he does not look "sick" to me.  

[mebby]

I would imagine its because once the video is compressed the effect will be far less noticeable or impressive in play than on a close-up still screen.

Hmmmm, I'm thinking it should be very noticeable. Just hit the ball into the rough.

[Buck]

I don't think we'll be showing any vids until we have new avatars TBH.

 
Is that business/strategy/tactical move?

It seems like a video could show the grass using the FreeCam or a shot in motion after contact where the Avatar wouldn't be seen, could it not?

[Affo]

Sorry, but 3D grass, avatars and clothing etc imho is 2nd in importance to game content (yes, a career mode) and ironing out dodgy lip out graphics (not physics, I personally think they are not bad at all). I would like more meat in my pie ahead of lovely picturesque pastry topping!

 

You will never replicate the patchiness of proper rough in a pc golf game. Every one of us who has played real golf and hit a drive into the rough has strolled up praying for a good lie or did it bounce up and lie on top will understand that trying to recreate this sort of thing in a pc game is very tough. Granted, it does look very pretty, happy to admit that, but I go for game content and playability over eye candy any day.

 

Only an opinion for discussion purposes.

[Buck]

@Affo:

I get what you're saying, but when you say "2nd in importance to game content", where are you drawing the line on what is or isn't "content"?

I would argue that clothing, avatars and courses are absolutely content and the way they look and how modern that look is, especially relative to competitive products (ahem - here comes TGC 2 BTW), absolutely matters.

Like when you say career mode matters more to you.
I also would like a career mode....but many people would like to have some new avatars with which to actually play that career mode. And how about some clothing and equipment to differentiate those career players and things to earn/buy work towards?

While we are out there, it would all look a lot better with newer lighting technology.

Basically - It's not binary. We all want more of everything.

[Affo]

I hear you Buck, everyone is looking for different things in a game/simulator..who'd be a game designer/developer?

 

Like I said, only my opinion, your wants maybe different, others different again, it's what makes the world go round, be damn boring if everyone was identical!

[Buck]

@Affo:

 

Agreed, and I'm honestly not even arguing for points I personally may care the most about, but more looking at it from what the larger gaming market likely wants more of.

 

If PG has console aspirations, they simply have no choice but to compete a bit more on the points that market cares about.

From where we are now, PG needs to have more gameplay features and modes, better avatars/equipment/gear as well as better lighting and graphical options on the high end.

 

PP knows this and I think that's why they appear to be focusing on some of those things.

[Acrilix]

To throw in another opinion, personally I don't give a toss about a career mode. 

I want the courses to look realistic and immerse me in the 'worlds' they create... I'm just not convinced yet that 3D grass is going to achieve this. While it looks very pretty and impressive, TGC followed this same path, and to me JNPG looks far more realistic with its 2D textures than TGC does with its 3D grass. I hope that PP proves me wrong though, and I'm blown away with it. Time will tell.

[clubcaptain]

The biggest question with 3D grass to me  is can it be blended gradually between terrain types eg. fairway to fairway fringe. The last thing i would want to see is the TGC look of putting two carpets edge to edge with  each other with such a sharp edge. No thanks.

[Dazmaniac]

Agree with Lez if I'm honest. Played Links 2003 for 10 plus years and never once played the games career mode.

Doubt I will in JNPG. Not saying it shouldn't be part of the game but not something I'm holding out for.

[Affo]

You know, Daz, you've stirred a memory there.

Links 2003, I did touch the career but mainly played the Links events, WireLS Tour, bit of KISS Tours. So the equivalent of OGT and PGLS now.

The more I think would I need a career mode personally? on the Xbox, all I played on Tiger was career, so perhaps I'm getting crossed wishes, certainly not got the time I used to, might just be a nice addition to jump in and out of, so hell yeah, bring on the eye candy! Lol

[DennisHarris]

3D grass IMHO will be a great visual improvement.  I only have questions about 3D grass as a player.  I hope the length and thickness of 3D grass will be customizable so the designers can reflect a visual representation to a player (in the rough) to determine how bad his/her shot will be.  This would essentially do away with the rough penalty and spin loss % we currently see.  Much more like real golf.            

[footslogger]

3D grass IMHO will be a great visual improvement.  I only have questions about 3D grass as a player.  I hope the length and thickness of 3D grass will be customizable so the designers can reflect a visual representation to a player (in the rough) to determine how bad his/her shot will be.  This would essentially do away with the rough penalty and spin loss % we currently see.  Much more like real golf.

I agree but it's not only the degree of rough which should determine the shot difficulty. The lie should come into it too. Whatever the state of the rough, the ball could be sitting up, normal or buried (the thicker the rough the more likelihood of a bad lie) and this could be shown visually by how much of the ball is visible.

[bigtee]

Can't believe any negativity towards 3d grass. It looks more rmpga than tgc in quality . It certainly adds something to the product. Poor rough is a blip on any golf game. 

[IanK]

Can't believe any negativity towards 3d grass. It looks more rmpga than tgc in quality . It certainly adds something to the product. Poor rough is a blip on any golf game. 

I agree. People are complaining about something they've not actually seen in the game.

[Acrilix]

I agree. People are complaining about something they've not actually seen in the game.

 

I am not complaining, just expressing a concern.

You could equally argue that people are praising it when they've not actually seen it in the game too.